You never know who’s gonna impact you or who you’re gonna impact. In this episode we talk with Maira Benjamin who changed the course of Dia’s projects with one comment over tea. She’s Sr. Director of Engineering at Change.org and a major champion for change. Listen to the episode now. Want us to talk about something specific? Got a comment or a question? Call us! 341-333-2997 www.linkedin.com/in.mairabenjamin
You never know who’s gonna impact you or who you’re gonna impact. In this episode we talk with Maira Benjamin who changed the course of Dia’s projects with one comment over tea. She’s Sr. Director of Engineering at Change.org and a major champion for change. Dia and Maira riff on the intersection of the arts engineering, Maira’s work making it possible for more black and brown folks to enter and excel in tech. Plus we hear an awesome shout out from a listener- an example again of how we never know who we’re impacting and how. Listen to the episode now. Want us to talk about something specific? Got a comment or a question? Call us! 341-333-2997
Maira Benjamin has been dedicated to the technology sector for over two decades playing instrumental roles in engineering organizations for over 10 technology companies. Currently, she is the Sr. Director of Engineering at Change.org. She's managed many different teams over the years, such as Computational Programming, Recommendations Platform, Search, Music Tools, Content Operations, and Growth and Retention. She is currently building teams responsible for the organizer empowerment at Change.org and the Communication and Integrity teams.
In addition to her professional life, Maira is a published author, lyricist, classically trained pianist, mother of a biochemical engineering doctoral student, and an avid knitter. Her exposure to music and the arts has informed her thought process regarding software development and management. She has a Bachelor of Arts in Statistics from U.C. Berkeley and a Master of Arts in Liberal Studies from Mills College in Oakland.
She is a founder of the Tech Intersections conference, a conference for women of color in Tech. She believes fervently in enabling people worldwide to promote the change that they want to see in their communities.
Connect with Maira here:
www.linkedin.com/in.mairabenjamin
Unknown Speaker 0:02
I basically came to my manager and said, You need to promote me.
Unknown Speaker 0:08
Is that an ask or a command?
Unknown Speaker 0:10
I was almost a command. But I did ask. I said, I think you need to promote me. And he actually surprised me as I've been thinking about it for a while. And then at that point I made the real ask is, well stop thinking about it. Do it. Beautiful.
Unknown Speaker 0:47
Hello, everyone. Welcome to the Dr. Bondi show a big podcast for women with goals. And honestly, it's a big podcast for anyone with goals. If you've got goals, we want to help you ask for more and get it and resource your dreams. So you can reach those goals as absolutely fast as you possibly can. And I am here joined with my, what do I say on air? bestie Arthur Leon Adams a third, aka baby Hi, baby.
Unknown Speaker 1:09
Hey, hey, how's it going? Yeah, on air bestie. I actually was just listening back to one of the episodes where that term was coined. I think we also said on air Bay,
Unknown Speaker 1:19
on our That's right. That's right. It's been so long. I feel like since we since we it's actually been since our launch party Episode 10 that we've gotten on a call together.
Unknown Speaker 1:29
Yeah, we were doing a bunch of episodes all really quickly to have them sort of back loaded for the launch of the podcast. And then once that happened, we are now getting into a cadence of recording them much more sporadically.
Unknown Speaker 1:44
Right, right. Like, I mean, we're having a cadence of being sporadic. That sounds totally on brand for me. Yeah. Yeah, but it's nice to see you and hear you.
Unknown Speaker 1:55
Yeah. Nice to see you too. What's been going on?
Unknown Speaker 1:57
Um, so I mean, I want to say so much and so little at the same time is really interesting. I this last week, I was backpacking for my 47th birthday, out on the Point Reyes National Seashore. And I have no I had not been backpacking like 25 years. And I went to When did I When did I go went two decades ago, with more than two decades ago, cuz I'll be married 21 years next week. So two decades plus, like with a boyfriend for you know, for two nights or something I was I go backpacking, and then I didn't go again until I was like 45 years old with with my bitch and wine group, actually. And now that we're all vaccinated, and we were outdoors, and we were able to sort of stay apart and sleeping around tents and all that we went on a backpacking trip, and it was completely 100% mazing 100% off the grid, we had hit one of those. We'd hit one of those weekends in the north coast in California where, you know, it could go either way, it could be 50 degrees, and fog wind that will just basically peel your face skin right off, or it's going to be 70 and beautiful. And we hit a 70 and beautiful weekend, it was like one of those wildly magical moments and we we stay where we landed on our hike. We stayed in the same site for two nights. We were in the middle of this mustard field. So in California, we have a mustard bloom that doesn't last very, very long. But I mean, the mustard was probably in some in some parts of this big Meadow where like six feet tall is crazy. Wow. So it felt like this very, like I felt like we were just like camping with the normies. You know, it was just really wonderful. Magical that way.
Unknown Speaker 3:37
It was like magical Fairyland.
Unknown Speaker 3:40
Totally. And you know, I'm really noticing after this last year of COVID how important it is for me to be outside and actually like look around when we went for spring break we took the kids backpack on not backpacking, we took the kids camping, we have folks who maybe hear me talk about this I love trailer camping. Yes, I do. So we have a we have a trailer, we pull that with a big truck. And we went out into the desert for a week and a half. And the we were at one site in the middle of the desert on private land that we had booked through hipcamp Shout out to have camp. And it was the night was so black. The stars were so bright. And it was for the first time I feel like in the hole last year, where I looked up, you know, like actually, like stopped and looked up and just really got present with I'm right here. And, and, like I let myself gaze for a minute, you know, yeah, this whole last year has been so like, what are we doing? What's happening next? You know, what's the plan? How do we have? How do we strategically you know, for those of you listening who might have a career that's been true in your workplaces, it's been true in small businesses like mine. It has been you know, really hard and staying focused and on task is the way for me to Sir to survive that, and you know, having a chance to look up and then right after that go backpacking and have a chance to, like, lay in the grass and gaze at the mustard is like, really critical. Yeah, that sounds awesome. So on our backpacking trip this weekend, it was really interesting on our hike, I think it was our hike out. And one of my girlfriends, we were talking about work and career stuff and goals and you know, as you do, and, um, and just the rhythm of our lives. And she said, like, we you look, you work a lot, don't you do like you work a lot, right? Like, it's just a given that, that I work all the time. And it just got me thinking about how we work. And you know, I, I don't work all the time. I work in it. To be really honest, I don't even get to my office till 10 o'clock, I wake up in the morning, I have an hour of quiet time in the morning, with coffee, I go into my garage, I do a workout or I take a ride or I take you know the dog for a walk along Hill walks. And I don't leave my house till 915 to get to my office, if a private office about you know, a couple miles from my home. Until you know 915 930 I try not to book meetings before 10 o'clock in the morning. I am actually a morning person, but that is my time. And I kick off, you know, at at 430 or five? Do I am I wildly productive during those hours. Absolutely. But I don't live a life where my work like work doesn't consume it in the way that I think it's easy to assume it does when you look at it from the outside. And I just want to like I don't know, we, we there's a lot of chat about like busy culture, Oh, I'm so busy. I'm so busy all the time. I don't have any time. And you know, I've said I'm not busy, I'm super engaged. And when I say no to something, it's not always because I can't make it or because I'm super booked. It's because I hold back the water. So I have spaciousness on either side of my day. And when I think about the way that I work, it's really in leverage points, I see all my work as a series of like deadlines, or a series of strike points or leverage points where we, you know, launch something or I step on a stage or, you know, we have a concentrated set of work, and then some relief. So it's like more like this accordion kind of rhythm and less like a marathon where it's 10 hours a day, every day, five, six days a week. And, you know, I wonder folks, an old mentor of mine said, you know, it's really nice to understand you work in leverage points, or do you work in layers? Are you someone who lays down layer on top of layer to build something you're building? Are you somebody that looks at something and sees it as a series of leverage points, and I work in a way that is a series of leverage points. And that helps me because it helps me manage my time in a way that is, it's like going into finals, you know, and when we're in university, like going into finals, you know, you plan for it, and so that I'm not trying to do all things all the time. So it was just interesting to think that like, yeah, it's easy to, it's easy for us to look at each other's lives and assume that we might be working all the time, or when we say we're really busy. You know, that that means, you know, we're completely compressed everything, everything is wall, the wall. And for me, I just wanted to tell the truth and say, it's not true for me. And if it's not true for you, that's cool. You don't have to be hyper compressed and busy to be legit. You know.
Unknown Speaker 8:43
I think there's a lot of people that think the opposite way.
Unknown Speaker 8:46
It's it's all over the map. I mean, I have a client right now who you know, he does his his work is all consuming. He's the founder of a startup that is in full on Build Mode, he has given his life over to this project in a way that I can't do in my life. And I don't not respect it. It's just, that's not how I can run my life and holds on to, you know, a sense that I have a life and that, you know, to be in relationship with my life outside of any one activity.
Unknown Speaker 9:22
Right. But I think that I understand how some people would look at you and think that you might be the type of person that's working 5060 hours a week, just because you're so accomplished and productive. Well,
Unknown Speaker 9:36
thank you. Thank you, Arthur, so much for saying that. I mean, there have been moments in my life. I remember I worked on an Olympic bid a handful of years ago, I flew halfway around the world. It was a three weeks of me being on site and in that case, I was everyone in my life. My friends, my family knew that like I was not only in an opposite timezone from them, but like I was on set for that project. Whenever the produce And the team needed me I was on call full. I basically, basically I'd said, Yes, I am working and here doing the thing, 24 hours a day for three weeks. And then I scheduled and then I scheduled in recovery time when I got home. Right? Right. So this is what I mean where like I have these, like leverage points where I dig in, and then I and then but but the days that when we're in between those big leverage points, those sort of lols You know, I'm really, I'm really invested in making sure that there's some spaciousness there.
Unknown Speaker 10:32
Yeah, me too. I mean, you know, I have a much more sporadic kind of schedule, because I freelance in a bunch of different things. But especially this last year, there hasn't been as much work. And so I always just know that even if I'm going hard on a project for like, a month, some big video thing with lots and lots of videos, and I'm producing, directing, writing and editing, I know that I'll have a month after that with kind of no work. Yeah. So I know that it's already built in. So I'm fine with going hard for, you know, three weeks. And then just because I know that I might not have any work,
Unknown Speaker 11:07
it's easy, you know, I have to battle a little bit of the like, feeling bad or kind of guilty, like, and I'm just sitting in my court yard at nine o'clock in the morning on Tuesday, looking at the fish pond, you know, but recognizing also that because I work in leverage points, I have to kind of go into these caves between larger projects where I have, I can use that to kind of recharge, so that when I do have to step on stage, or when I do have a moment where it's heads down, I've got it, you know, I have a full tank. Yeah. Um, so yeah, I just that's that was kind of what was on my mind this last week, especially because right now we're kind of in a law, we're between having completed a bunch of work around some strategic projects with large brands for communications work, and between another set of a few sets of some goals in my business, and another set of of inquiries and proposals that are out sort of cooking. And so I have to take, I have to notice that oh, this is that we're in that cradle time. And I need to use that to reconnect with my own sense of self and life to one I'm hands down again, I'm coming from I'm coming in with a full tank.
Unknown Speaker 12:15
Today, we had a really nice shout out about the show on Apple podcasts from Maya T. She said dia is jam packed full of knowledge for women who want to level up. She's personally changed the course of my life and continues to inspire and coach me love that she's reaching so many more people via the podcast.
Unknown Speaker 12:32
This is so lovely to hear this. And I actually I think I know who this is. And what's interesting about this is that yes, she and I had a conversation about a really critical moment in her career on her life. I don't know, probably over a year ago, if that's if this is who I think it is. And it's really interesting to see. So as the this podcast launched this show up here, because I didn't know that that's the kind of impact we had. I mean, it's my intention to have that kind of impact. But this is like a perfect evidence that you just, you could have one conversation with a colleague, you could have one mentoring conversation, you could give one piece of advice or, you know, make one introduction to someone in your life and in your network and make a huge difference that you don't even know about. We never know what kind of impact we're having. Well, we might suspect, but we don't always really know. So this is really beautiful. And thank you for that Maya T.
Unknown Speaker 13:27
If the podcast is having an impact on you. There's a lot of things you can do. You can subscribe, you can rate and review and that helps the Deobandi she'll reach more people. If you had a question or something for Dia, you can call us at 341-333-2997 and leave a message and we might answer your question on a future podcast.
Unknown Speaker 13:51
Cool. So let's talk about what we're doing today. Arthur? Yes, we have a guest today we do we have with us, Myra Benjamin and super excited to have her because if you've been listening to the show all nine or 11 episodes before this was released, you'll know that Myra Benjamin was really instrumental in the early in what is now the form of project asked I can auctioneer which is my project to help a million women ask for more and get it she was so instrumental in how I saw what the what this project could really impact. And we'll talk about that in our interview with her. She's been dedicated to the technology sector for over two decades, playing instrumental roles in engineering organizations for over 10 different technology companies, which I think is really interesting because think about it think about how many changes and decisions she's had to make two decades 10 technology companies. That's a pretty strong ratio of like years to two different jobs and roles. So I'd love that about her. Currently, she is Senior Director of engineering@change.org. Many of you may be familiar with that platform, and I met her at endora when she was director of engineering there, she's managed many different teams over the years such as computational programming, recommendations, platforms, search, music, tools, content, operations and growth and retention. And she's currently building teams responsible for organizer empowerment@change.org, and the communications and integrity teams. She's a published author, a lyricist, which I love. She is classically trained. She's a classically trained pianist. She's a mother of a bio chemical engineering doctoral student, big shout out to her and an avid knitter. And I love that I love that we know this about her. When I saw her give, when she was hosting the event that I spoke out with her for the first time she was wearing a knitted Wonder Woman shawl that she made herself like I just have seen that in action, her exposure to music. And the arts, she says really informs her thought process regarding software development and management both and we're going to talk about that in our conversation with her. She is a Bachelor of Arts in statistics from UC Berkeley and a Masters of Arts in liberal studies from Mills College in Oakland. And notice she has a technology career, even though she came from that educational platform. So really, really interesting. She's a founder of the technical intersection conference, a conference for women of color and tech and she believes fervently in enabling people worldwide to promote the change that they want to see in their own communities. badass. Myra, I'm so stoked. I'm just gonna say the word stoked. I'm so stoked to have you here. Because I've been telling, I've been telling my professional community the story that I'm about to tell right now for like, two years, and I've never, I don't know that I've ever cycled it back to you. But I'm so happy to have you here because you were instrumental in shaping sort of the not the final form, but sort of the mature form of my wild project called Project asked like an auctioneer. I remember so so the first opportunity, I had to stand in front of a room and tell the full story of what you know what it means to ask like an auctioneer was at Pandoras women in tech summit, which you invited me through a mutual connection to to come give on stage there. And I we met beforehand. And at we sat down in Pandora kitchen, and we were talking just about life and work and career stuff and, and about project as like an auctioneer and what it was. And I remember saying like, Look, I don't know that this is right for internal teams, because when I originally thought about how to use the mental model of auctioneering, to help women ask for more and get it I was really thinking about like independent professionals, freelancers, you know, women in small business, you know, experts. And only about dollars, you know, because auctioneering is about the money, you know, is like how do we put more money in the hands of women. So we they can have more impact, they can have more success, they can resource their dreams, they can you know, money is power. And you were like, Girl, you are exactly girl, you
Unknown Speaker 18:14
were like you are missing it. If you don't recognize the 1000s of asks that we have to make over the courses of our careers, whether you're in house or out of house, and you're missing a whole impact opportunity if you don't recognize that and apply that in that area. And it just cracked my head open. And I was like yes. And since then that's proven to be true. We've been you know, we've brought the product, the the workshop and the keynote, which is now two separate experiences to you know, alphabets x team, Dropbox, Facebook, Latinas, in tech a few times, professional associations, like women of color, advancing peace and security or w caps. And, and it's true that so I'm going to stop talking soon, I promise. It's true that so many of the asks that these women are bringing to the table when we talk about how to strategically use asking and how to ask for more when you go to make the asks that matter are, are not just about money. And in particular, particularly in house where comp review is like really rigid in your in salary bands that are established, you know, there are million other ways for you to advance your career that aren't just about, you know, focusing on money. So I'm curious. So hello, and curious, what are your thoughts about that since since we had that conversation,
Unknown Speaker 19:31
I actually do reflect on that conversation a lot. And I've also told people about you and what happened and people have been curious about it. And I've really, at this point, have moved that model into my operating manual, so to speak with other people and other women. And I just I boldly tell them just ask, ask and I say what's the worst that can happen. And usually they come back and say, I don't know, I'm scared or whatever. And then I say the worst that can happen is that they say no. And you're back in the same situation that you were before. And after that blows up their mind a little bit. They they move forward. And women have come back to me and said, Yeah, that was the thing that got me past. My fear.
Unknown Speaker 20:28
I find a lot of folks that come across, you know, that end up in my workshops and keynotes, you know, beyond the sort of ordained, you know, negotiation moments, you think about comp salary promotion, when they're in house, they sort of get like, well, I want to, I want to ask for more and get I want to use asking a success strategy, what would I even ask for, and it's turned out Myra. In the two years, and the hundreds of conversations I've had, that the asks that I'm hearing women make fall into four categories. And folks who are listening, if you've heard me talk about this before, it is money, you know, whether it's, you know, raising the rates on your proposal, if you're not an in house professional, or it is about salary comp, you know, blah, blah, blah, it is also about influence. And I think you pointed to this, the third one actually, in our conversation influence around, you know, expanding network meeting people that can help advance you getting on stages, you know, speaking at your all hands for the very first time in your career, you know, around visibility. And then the third one is around, you know, I think of like as authority, which you said to me in those early conversations that, you know, it's not just Promotion Authority, but it's like, ownership around decisions. Yes, exactly. It's all that and more sparkles. Yes, exactly. And then the fourth one is about balance, like bringing into alignment, what we're doing in our careers with who we actually are, and that sometimes, you know, in house, we have to in house and out of house we're having to make asks that help us course, correct, like, Oh, I tried this thing. And it wasn't, it's not quite me, and I gotta find my way back to the marketing group, or I gotta find my way back to being an independent professional, we got to find, you know, we got to pivot a little bit so that we're keeping in balance, who we are and what we're doing.
Unknown Speaker 22:13
Exactly, yes, yes, this is all important. And I was so thrilled when you move forward with everything and glad to, you know, reconnect with you again, in the two years or more that we have met.
Unknown Speaker 22:27
I know, it's so so interesting. Two years goes like that, now that I'm as old as old as I am. It's kind of crazy. So I'm super curious. One thing I've noticed in since doing this work is and in the 20 years of the leadership communications coach, this didn't come up as much because the the lens that I was looking at storytelling around didn't didn't include sort of, it just wasn't this is just not a the exact overlap. Is that is that goals are pretty loaded for folks. You know, I mean, I had I there's so much gold shame. You know, I we think we have the wrong goals. We, you know, we get crappy feedback about the goals we do have I had one woman in a workshop tell me that her manager told her she had the right goal, but the wrong reason for having it. Oh, yeah. Oh, no.
Unknown Speaker 23:19
We're actually going through a situation here at work where we're trying to do the OKR process, objectives and key results. And of course, we're going through it and there was no training in this, and we we pointed this out, and they backtracked and said, Oh, yeah, that's right. We need some training. And so what happened was, people were setting these very ambitious goals, and then feeling bad when they didn't reach them. And were as I was really chill about it. And I said, hey, it's just a guidepost. You know, don't don't get really worked over on it. But you know, people look at a goal and they feel like they have to attain it. And they don't they fail.
Unknown Speaker 24:01
Yes. And how is your relationship? Like? What is your relationship with goals in your own career in life? And you know, what do they look like? And how have they changed
Unknown Speaker 24:11
over the years? Yeah, so I have a really simple formula. I know how everybody at the beginning of the year starts with new year's resolutions, and they have this whole huge list of things. You know what, I do one thing, I just have one goal every year, and I know it sounds boring, but it has opened doors for me. And my goal every year is learn something new. That's it. And wherever it takes me is the journey. And so I am actually able to complete my goal every year is most of the time I end up learning more than one thing. But setting that goal of I'm going to learn something new for the year has guided my career for a long time now
Unknown Speaker 24:59
and how When you think about something new, do you set what it is? Or do you just get curious and go? What is it let it show itself to me? Like, what is the thing I'm going to learn? Or do you say, this year, I'm going to blabbity blah, learn this,
Unknown Speaker 25:13
I actually what I do at the beginning of the year is I open up myself to I'm going to learn something new, I don't know what it is, it's going to reveal itself, right. But once it reveals itself, then I become more specific about it. So certain years are, oh, I, I've suddenly it's revealed that I need to learn a new programming language for whatever reason it is. And then I go after it, then I become very specific, I need to learn this programming language by month x or by this time or whatever. And then it that's how I pursued this. And it's it's really strange, but it's, it's helped me so much. And let go of this goal anxiety that people have.
Unknown Speaker 25:55
I love this. And so I hear it sort of like a two hit punch where you're like, you like you set the intention, create openness and curiosity, then identify it, and then go for it. So that's actually four steps, but two in that, like, there's the, the opening to it, and then the seeing it what it is, yeah, yeah. And when did that happen for you? When did you figure out that like, Oh, this is my, this is the way I do goals.
Unknown Speaker 26:20
Um, I think it happened for me, when I had my daughter. And now she's a, she's gonna be I'm very proud to announce this, she's gonna defend her thesis in Biochemical Engineering in June. So I'm going to actually travel to see her do this. So this is big reading, when I had her, I had this list of things, I got to do this, I got to do that. And then it was just it started breaking down. Pretty much the first year she was born, because it was just too much stuff. You when you're a new parent, there's all these things, and these goals and these aspirations, and I just had to learn to let go of it. In your second year, it was, well, this is a journey, you know, let's open ourselves up to you know, what it is that you want, that she wants to learn and that I learned in the process. So you know, the second year started, well, and in first year started walking, and then I learned that I needed to childproof my house, things of that nature. And so if I treat the goal as a journey, it becomes a method for opening myself up to all kinds of opportunities.
Unknown Speaker 27:28
That's beautiful. And along those along that journey. What have been, you know, what was a big ask you made in your life or career and like, what happened? And what was the impact? There
Unknown Speaker 27:40
have been actually two big asks, the first big ask was, I basically came to my manager and said, You need to promote me.
Unknown Speaker 27:50
That isn't an ask or a command.
Unknown Speaker 27:52
I love that almost a command. But I did ask, I said, I think you need to promote me. I've been doing this work. And that, you know, that was it. And he actually surprised me and said, I've been thinking about it for a while. And then at that point I made the real ask is well stop thinking about it. Do it.
Unknown Speaker 28:15
Beautiful. That's really interesting, because I think sometimes we don't surface the things we want, because we're not sure the world is ready. But we don't know what they're thinking. We don't know where they are so surfacing a desire surfacing and ask thirst surfacing, you know, letting you know, I talk a lot about like letting your dreams be known by the people around you can create intersections that that if you don't surface them, they can't happen. There's intersections between that current thinking of the person you're talking to and what you want yourself. Yes,
Unknown Speaker 28:46
yes, exactly. And and that really opened up my eyes because I had never done that before. And when was that in your career? Oh, my gosh, it was five, six years ago. I just asked to be a director. I've always had that goal in my mind. And at that point, I said, If I don't do it, it's not gonna happen. And so now I approach everything the same way. in that, in that if you don't ask you don't get Yeah,
Unknown Speaker 29:19
exactly. So you grew up here in the Bay area where we're recording this, in fact, in East Oakland and sleuthing around the internet a little bit. I learned that you are a first gen American and that you know, in your, in your family and family's legacy. You are the first set a lot of things. Yes, I am. So can you
Unknown Speaker 29:40
talk about that a little bit? Yeah, so I am, as you mentioned, the first generation American I and my parents came here from Dominican Republic. And we they did not have a chance to graduate from high school where they were. So as a result I was the first person in the family to graduate from high school. And then I followed that with graduating from college, gaining a bachelor's degree, and then follow that with a master's degree. And also the first person in my family to actually start earning more than my parents. So that that was a whole paradigm shift. And the first person in my family to be stepping into a new kind of tech world, the new profession. My mom was a, she's a blue collar worker, and she's a seamstress. And my father was a merchant marine. And so they were very totally in the middle class, and actually more lower middle class because we were in East Oakland. And so yeah, it's just been a journey for me of so many firsts, and also the first person in my family to speak English, and had to teach my brothers and my parents as a consequence of that action as well. So when you say you were the first to earn more than your parents, and that that was a paradigm shift, for whom was that a paradigm shift for you or for them, or for the whole system? For for me more than them. Because although I've always had my intention to get out of East Oakland, due to the environment, I didn't have an idea of what that would look like. And so again, once again, opening myself up to what does that look like? And I figured out that that would look like getting a degree. And that was something that my parents never had a chance to do. And so they didn't know how to guide me or counsel me through that whole process, you know, the whole college admissions process and being on campus. And, you know, what, how do you handle all that I had to work my way through school, because we were not well off. And scholarships weren't exactly available. But I did get a few, just not enough to cover everything. So who did? Who were your stewards during that time. So, um, there was a program on campus that encourage students of color, to stay in school and provide guidance and counseling and so forth. So I leaned into them for moments for when I was questioning myself as to whether or not I'm going to actually make it through this thing. I had friends. And of course, my family was supportive as well. When did you pick up music? I'm curious, Oh, my gosh, I picked that up earlier. It was an elementary school, it's late for people. Unfortunately, usually, the great musicians start when they barely talk. I started when I was probably around sixth grade, or so and but picked it up really quickly. And that was a that's continued to be a love of mine.
Unknown Speaker 33:13
Yeah, you said that it that your musical, your music and arts, relationship with music and arts informs how you manage and your engineering career. So I love this idea of this, bringing an outside discipline into another discipline in order to create a framework for your own leadership. Or that that shows up a lot in the hundreds and hundreds of coaching conversations I've had with my communications clients that a lot of very accomplished high impact leaders that I've worked with, bring something from the outside and apply it to their discipline. And there's almost sometimes a little not shame, but like a little secrecy about that, like, Well, actually, how I do this other thing is using something from way over here, but don't tell any because it's not. It's not legit. You know, but but talk to me about like, how is it that you've used music and art and applied it to management and engineering?
Unknown Speaker 34:07
Yes. So as a musician, you learn how to be disciplined and breaking things like pieces of music down and practicing it until you get to the next section that you may have difficulties with. That's not unlike the same way software engineering is you have a problem, and you want to break it down and you work on it. And then you move on to the next piece. And the other point of art and music and all my Liberal Studies background as well, is that there is a mode of communication that is used in liberal studies with all my studies, I had to learn how to write really well communicate that those thoughts and ideas and question as well. And so all of these things are aspects that I've heard into my management, where I lean on clear communication, where I like to express myself through a written medium and making sure people understand. And where I engage with engineers and managers, I'm breaking down information, and also projects into a digestible chunks of pieces that they can deliver on, and then work on that delivery aspect. So all related,
Unknown Speaker 35:28
I love that you're like naming it and claiming it as a leadership tool. And I think, you know, for folks who are listening, you know, look around, if you if you take a 360 view of your life, hobbies, ways of working ways of playing, and, and let ourselves name and claim something outside of our professional discipline and see how it can help accelerate or make sense of our professional world. And sometimes it can be real, a real signature, not just skill, but a signature way of moving in the world that helps us be successful, even though it's comes from outside of that particular discipline, I think, yeah, that's beautiful. I love that. So you also are a major champion for diversity, inclusion representation. And really, I understand very specifically, you know, a champion of having black women and women of color in STEM and software. Is there a thing that happened? Or when did that start for you? And was there a sort of an instigating moment where you were like, I'm not just gonna participate in this, I'm actually going to be an active voice in it. Over the course of your career,
Unknown Speaker 36:39
yeah. So as I started my career in tech, I did notice I was usually the only woman or a person of color on all male teams. And I was okay with it for a while, because I actually have brothers. And so I can use to that environment where I'm the only girl and so forth. But I think it was halfway through when I started switching into management, that I started thinking, this can't be the paradigm or the future world that I want to be in, where I continue to be the only person that looks like me in a team. And so from that point on at every company I've been at, I've started community groups, I've worked on it, initiatives for hirings to make sure that we have representation, and so forth. But particularly at Pandora really came to a fine point where I had gained enough skills, to understand how to organize how to understand how to create these communities, how to, to champion them, and advocate on behalf of them, and also to lean on budget and making sure that it's funded and so forth. And then the last piece of all of this was thinking that, oh, there isn't really a conference there out there for women of color, we need a conference that just kind of takes that in and creates that. And so I said, you know, following the paradigm of not asking for permission, just go ahead and create it. And we had been running this for three years. But we know hiccup with the pandemic. Sure. And unfortunately, with males, I think dissolving in a way, we may not be able to recreate that. So hopefully I can get back to that again in the future.
Unknown Speaker 38:39
Yeah, for folks who are listening. I don't know that. You know, we mentioned in your in your intro, Myra, that you're a graduate of Mills College, which has a huge, you know, initiative around equity inclusion. And it is it is a old college that is closing and turning into an institute. And so that was where you were hosting that conference. And so things are changing. Yes, definitely. It's a little sad, but hopefully we can get the baton going again. Well, it's not surprising to me that you're now@change.org Myra, I can tell you about that. When I saw that you made that transition. I was like, Oh, of course.
Unknown Speaker 39:15
Yeah, because this is also leading into my vision of what my future self is. And that is I want to make sure that I'm actually making the real commitment towards changing the world. And so when this opportunity opened up, I took it so I want to fulfill my intention around this and not, you know, just say, Yeah, one day someday soon, whatever, just, you know, grab the opportunity when it comes to you.
Unknown Speaker 39:43
And what is your advice for folks who are the marginalized ones
Unknown Speaker 39:48
to approach people that look like you that are in the positions that you want to see yourself in and you may be surprised that they will reach out To you and provide that helping hand. I've told people don't be afraid to ask, of course, for the help that you need. And you will be surprised that people will in turn, help you,
Unknown Speaker 40:14
Myra, it's been so lovely to talk to you. I'm so thrilled to connect with you this way. And to just just know that like, I have you in my like, you're part of my gravity, you're like, you know, I don't know if I'm, if I'm, like orbiting you, or if you're orbiting me, or it's just sort of like, I'm just you're in my sphere. We are a binary star system. There you go. Perfect. Perfect. Okay, that was great. Yeah, she's amazing. She really is I was just, I'm just really noticing like, she's got like, a gentleness about her that is about a focus that is just really lovely. I love encountering leaders that are the sort of go against our assumptions about what like senior, you know, executive types are supposed to be like, and I just hear a lot in my work around like, Oh, well, you know, they're just executive. So that's how they are from certain ranks, you know, I'm gonna call them ranks in an organization. I'm like, No, you know, in my 20 years of leadership communications coach, like, people are not always what you think, like, make room for make room for all types at all levels?
Unknown Speaker 41:26
Yeah, I mean, and that sort of ties into, you know, what we were talking about in the interview about what she's trying to do.
Unknown Speaker 41:33
I just love it. I think it's so that the, the big thing that stands out for me is just how she was so clearly able to take her music education, and how you learn and be masterful in music and apply it directly to how to learn and be masterful around a particular engineering projects. Like it's such an interesting one to one of two unrelated territories.
Unknown Speaker 41:58
Yeah, and I, I kind of think that there's another aspect to it as well, where when you're spending all this time doing something that's in a more creative field and part of your brain, that just helps you be more creative in your field. I mean, I've worked with a lot of producers, you know, video producers, who say, Oh, I'm not a creative, I'm just a producer, this is what I do. I make schedules and all this stuff. And it's like, as a person who does a lot of creative things like directing, and recording music and stuff that helps me when I'm producing, you know, I understand what we're making. And the best way to make it is super important to me as just a producer. So,
Unknown Speaker 42:38
yes, so good. I mean, I think, you know, a lot of, I don't know what, like, I can't remember anything these days, but reading a book recently, ah, if I can, if I can think of it, I'll add it to the show notes. But um, they were talking about that, that, you know, you don't you having an approach to something is really, really key, not knowing there's not like a right way always to tackle something. But if you have, if you have a way to approach approach a problem, no matter where you draw that approach from, it can be it can be, you can actually elevate your sort of win rate, if you're, if you're better at designing approaches to to solving a problem, again, even if they're outside of a particular discipline. So I just, it's just, I think we all can draw on, on our, our whole buffet of not just skills, but ways of approaching problems and apply them to each other and this sort of interdisciplinary way, and we can unlock a lot for ourselves, if we let ourselves do it. If we don't say immediately, oh, that's the wrong way to approach it or right way to approach it. It's like if we're, if we're, if we can explore different approaches and actually see what the impact and outcome is and then name it and claim it. Great. Instead of decide before we even dig in that it's not the right approach.
Unknown Speaker 44:04
Yeah, I was I was gonna say name and claim it. Say yes to yourself, all the stuff from the previous
Unknown Speaker 44:12
so love to having Myra for those of you who are listening. Um, you can find her on LinkedIn, we'll, we will add her linked in to the show notes. And we're gonna see on the flip side, that's right. See you later. Bye.
Unknown Speaker 44:30
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